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Thanks for the update Katie, it's so nice to know about the bits we can't see! Good news about Garten attempting to fish, isn't it? Now all she needs to do is learn where to find clean water and some fish! Odin seems to have gone? Someone thought they saw him this morning, on the nest. Obviously not him then. It's so difficult to make out who is who these days, our family flatly refuses to stand still and face the camera! Bad ospreys! I do wish Mallachie would get off her tree and try to fly a bit further, and try and fish too, then I would feel more confident about her migration.

Thanks you againn pony tail girl.  

What a wonderful job you have and you do it so very well.   Def. break out the bubbly when this lots go :)))

Is this the longest you have had ospreys stay  at LG Katie ??

Thanks Katie, what will happen if they do not go?  Would they be able to survive the Scottish climate? (I bet these are very stupid questions!)

Thanks, Katie ... great to have some definite news from LG ... rather than our guesses! Glad to hear Garten is actually trying to fish ... I hope Mallachie has a go at fishing soon.

I noticed a nip in the air last night when walking the dogs so they had better get wee spurt on but Mallachie looks so contended sitting on her perch watching the world go by, like someone suggested we will have to give her a push. She is gorgeous we will miss them all but she won't go until she is ready. I have not got a clue about Garten where is she pleased to read she made an attempt at fishing although thought they waited till migration before they started fishing but you never know with this lot do you

Katie, thanks for the update.  I did think Mallachie was 'home alone' earlier.  Wish she would try to fish for herself - does anyone know if Rothes fished for herself before setting off?  Off shortly to dig agility training.  I'll check what you've all written when I come back.  

Thanks very much for that comprehensive update Katie. This family are really rewriting the rule book. Eldest chick migrating first and now the male Odin going next. Who would have predicted that. We await the next episode of this great saga with interest.

Good news that Garten is at least attempting to fish. Once she finds a fully stocked source of fish she will be ok. That just leaves Mallachie. She needs to get fishing soon. The most surprising thing is that EJ is still around.

Thanks ever so much, Katie.  Nice to have some background on the bits we can't see.  Wonderful, in fact!

Many many thanks Katie  - it's so kind of you to 'water' us. We've always got our tongues hanging out for any news.

Thank you Tish - for the heads up.

Now to read what's been said.

patriciat

What is dig agility training.  I'm exhausted just thinking about it.:))   DOG   sorry!!!  LOL

DjoanS

GLad you heard me you cheeky wee thing!! :)))

Surely now there can be no standard rules for migration etc.  for ospreys.  Ospreys can't read. Eldest chick first not not the mother, then the father then what .  it's just all higgledy piggledy:)

Garten and Mallachie on branch!!

Thank you Katie for the update I am sure it has cleared up a lot of points for people!! Is it a bit worrying that Mallachie is not doing much flying, will she have the stamina for a long flight, or is she just saving herself??  Good to hear her sister is at least trying to catch her own food. I wonder if EJ stayed in the background on purpose yesterday to see if her girls would fend for themselves and then realised that they needed feeding this morning.  All these points just seem to go through my mind!!

Tish in 2004 the youngest chick left on 12th September.

Gosh, Odin maybe gone?  This wee family do not have an osprey rule book do they?

Tiger

You look so wise in your avatar.   THanks for the info.

anyway did it survive ?

Garten with Mallachie for a few minutes now Garten has flown off. Been a lot more interesting today at LG.

Tiger should be our in house ospreyologist!  

Sorry  It's nearing that time of day.  A glass of wine might help perhaps,,,,,

Hang on  who's this with a fish  Garten  got his own fish did he??

Did anybody see Garten actually land with this fish?

Garten on the nest with a fish. Where did that come from. It is still flapping about so must be fresh. Garten battling to control it.

Gosh Tiger, thanks for that, that was late! Long time no hear, are you alright??

She's shaking her feathers oh please let her have fished for this one herself:))

The fish is still alive OMG  sorry revdtricia  

EJ wouldn't have given her a live fish would she!    The fish is dead now.  .................

NO it isn't it wriggles again.  Fir goodness sake .  Poor fish!!

Where did Garten get the live fish she is eating? Did she catch it herself? She was trying to kill it, as it kept flapping!

I truly think  that our Garten dunked for his own fish tonight.   Well done the baby>***

Tish the 2004 chicks were the only brood to be definitely sired by Henry. Whether 27, 28 and 29 were ever seen again I do not know. If so Henry may not have left a dynasty.

Garten has been tearing at that fish and it wriggles still...  

5.55-Katie said that Malcom had seen Garten fishing in Locg Garten today, she is on the nest now with a small fish and it was wriggling before she started eating it's head (eh), had she just caught it or did anyone at Loch Garten see EJ bringit in. I hope she caught it?

JILLIAN

5.58 and that fish wrigged again  what does it take to kill it.  

this is too gorey for me  

Gosh that poor fish is still flapping its tail whilst being eaten - I just shrieked out again! :o( x

Thank you Tiger

It would be nice tro think he did leave one.  In my head he did!! OK  :)))

It was you I heard Lesley.  Isn't it......  vile, good clever I don't know  

eeeeeew! Live fish on nest!

I honestly can't see how Garten would have had time to catch that fish herself. She was sitting next to Mallachie on the branch literally a minute earlier.

Cirrus come back and leave those herrings alone...  I think Garten caught his own fish  

Tish have you been at the vino again? LOL you keep turning dear Garten into a boy!!!!! :o( x

well, judging from Sandy's images It looks like Garten could have stolen Mallachie's fish which certainly doesn't make sense cos surely Mallachie would have eaten more than the head !!!!   since she was eating all day.

So, we have a conundrum here. What took place between the tree (see Sandy's image) and the nest?

I just don't get it. Who saw what please?

Thank you Kate for the update, at least we know that Rothes is safe!!  Garten is certainly tucking into the fish as though she's not eaten for a while, but I suppose thats Garten for you.

although

Although it looks like EJ brought in this last fish maybe that will be her last offering and she will be off, leaving Garten and Mallachie to follow and start fishing for themselves. Maybe thats the only way the girls will realise that mum's not delivering any more and that we have to do it for ourselves.  We can only wait and see!!!!!

sorry lesley and yes I am having a smallish glass of wine..:) How very remiss of me It must have been all that excitement.  Do you think she caught it herself lesley?  

Sandy R

I think she left a bit longer than that.  We can check if anybody has stills on the DU

No way Garten caught that fish. It was all too quick. EJ probably dropped it off for Garten. Fishing is difficult in nearby Lochs due to peaty nature of the water and not a lot of fish.

Janr she was wt and shaking her feather and the fish was so alive for ages.  

I'm here, I'm here Tish. Stuffed with herring and I've only had two - just the fish, no spuds or veg or what ever and I'm absolutely stuffed. If only they had been bought and caught in Scotland.

It WAS killed Patrizia - it was headless !    LoL   It's just its nerves.

Tiger IS wise Tish

Good piccy Cirrus.  We now need Hercule Poirot or Sherlock Holmes to help dece  "Wher the Fish Came From""

decide instead of dece

Well. Garten is still eating but is now trying to defend her catch, has flown off with it probably to the tree. Were's Mallachie, is she waiting in the tree????  Looking now at an empty nest.

If there is anybody at LG centre please type a few words and let us know if Garten caught her own fish :))

18:22 Garten flies off with the fish.

I don't think Garten caught the fish either Alan. It was presented headless, n'etait il pas?

It is only just as long as Garten  - I would not call it a whale even if EJ caught it which I personally think she did.

Indeed Tish - I'll call him now.

Right, here are the facts!!   Garten was on the tree watching Mallachie and flew off at 17.45.  Just over 3 minutes later she was on the nest with a big fish.  As far as I'm concerned, there's no way she could have caught it herself!!!  

I'm sure you're right Alison. She must have seen an incoming EJ with fish in her talons.

THANKS very much for the update. It is great to  know for sure what is really happening at the nest  instead of our guessing.  

It would be  great if Garten caught her own fish. Garten was the first to fledge, she may be the first to  fish and I'll bet she is the next to leave. She may be the youngest, but she seems to be developing her skills faster than Mallachie.

Odin possibly gone and EJ still there?   Well there goes another page from Richard's rule book LOL

Well what an eventful day it has been with lots of good viewing. What will we all do when they have gone?

Thank you Katie. You have filled in all the gaps and answered all our guesswork. Odin gone and EJ still caring for her daughters. Looking at tomorrow's weather forecast, I wouldn't think any bird would want to leave in those conditions, but this is EJ and her daughters!!!

I posted this on the Daily Update blog. Garten was seen "trying" to fish which means she has made the connection that the fish  are in water. That is a huge development !.

Even if she didn't catch the fish she is eating she  now knows where fish come from!.  Before this discovery all she  knew was the fish are delivered by her parents, she didn't know  where they come from.

This discovery will serve her well on her migration because she will look for bodies of water so she can eat.

Ok. According to the "rulebook", the female adult osprey leaves on migration, and then the male adult teaches the juveniles to fish. However, I have never heard any reports of Odin training these young.

This is backed up by the fact that neither Garten nor Mallachie appears to be travelling to any viable fishing sites, which the male would have shown them. I know that Garten was fishing in LG, but it's supposed to be too muddy/peaty for productive fishing.

So is that why EJ is staying, because she realizes that Odin is young and inexperienced; perhaps he wasn't able to train M & G? (No criticism intended; Odin was a great provider!) Or did Odin try, and M & G were not developed enough or motivated enough to be successful?

So is this a bit of a gender role reversal. EJ, instead of Odin, is staying until she is sure the young can fish? Will she commence training in earnest, if M & G continue to lag in their skills? Or did the "rulebook" not give the females due credit for training the young. Maybe this situation happens often?

BARBARA JEAN:  Thanks for that assurance, that it makes a lot of sense for the young so 'see' where their fish comes from.  So then, a migrating osprey only has to search for bodies of water as good places to stop off, like a motorway service station, I imagine!!

Dramatic events this afternoon.  These birds still continue to surprise us.

If you have now gone, Odin the Magnificent, then Bon Voyage and good hunting, & please return to Loch Garten again next year. You take with us many memories and many thanks.

Thanks very much Katie for your update...it's great to really know what is happening, instead of guessing.

Good to know Garten is trying to fish, albeit she will have a hard job in that peaty Loch Garten, bless her.

So it seems EJ must be still here, as the girls are still being fed......surely not for much longer.

Strange that Odin has gone before EJ....maybe they decided between them that EJ was the best one to keep those hungry sisters fed LOL :)

Barbara Jean: Good points. I also realize that ospreys learn to fish successfully during migration. So maybe EJ just wants to make sure that Mallachie gets the connection. Fish = bodies of water.

KATIE:   Nearly forgot to thank you for your kind blog, keeping us up to date with all the family.

I think about Rothes still, and wonder what her life is like now.  Will she stay there, or just go as far as Spain?  Or will she make another almighty push when it gets colder, and go all the way to Africa?

Good luck fabulous Odin, please come back to Loch Garten next March/April.

Someone was asking about tagging and collecting monies and why not 3 tags and several were asking generally.

For those who are new to the blogging or this site in short.

This year they had 1 tracking device left from last year as the 3rd chick died at one month old so they ordered a second for this summer from America.

Donations of £20.00/£30.00 and sometimes more were sent to Richard to pay for the once device ordered from America and to pay for costs for tracking 2 ospreys.

Monies were collected very quickly over £4000.00.

Loch Garten team did not know whether 1/2 or 3 chicks or none would survive. When things were looking great for little Garten many of us including myself wanted Garten tracked as well but Richard informed us on several occasions that it was too late to order one from America in time.

Garten has gone on to prove how strong she is and in hindsight it may have been better to track her instead of Mallachie, however at the time of ringing the older/stronger ones were chosen as they had a better chance of survival.

I have asked Richard several times about starting collecting donations from 1st September or as soon as the last bird has left whilst there is a great amount of interest in the ospreys. If we collected for 3 no matter what happens next year, if some of them were not used they could be kept for the following year.

I feel very sad that all the children cannot be followed and would be grateful if they could all be followed next year.

What do others feel and perhaps I could write a message for Richard tomorrow and others do one as well so he can see the support for this idea?

Look forward to hearing from you all.

JILLIAN

Jillian: I would donate to track next year's chicks.

JILLIAN:    I agree it would be nice to know what happens/where they go etc. as regards the offspring each year, and I'm sure we could soon raise enough money for whatever was needed, given the enormous interest in this site, and the enthusiasm of all the bloggers; but if you read back you will see somewhere that a lot of information about ospreys has been generated by following the movements of the more mature adult birds.  Unfortunately occurences like the sad losses of the chicks last year are not uncommon, and so the use of the tracking is in doubt. I'm not against the whole idea, but not sure if is of value to those who study these things in depth.

Although I would be willing to donate and did so this year I feel it is up to LG to decide how many of the chicks if any should be tagged next time. We must remember that the mortality rate for these chicks is around 70% and although things are going well at the moment we must prepare for the fact that probably 2 of these three chicks wont make it. If this exercise will help more of these ospreys to survive I am all for it but if it is just for our benefit to follow them on GE then I am not happy to donate. I dont mean to be negative but all I am saying is that LG are the experts and it is their decision.

I donated Jillian but I thought it WAS for next year as the tracking devices for 2009 were already a done deal (weren't they?)

If it were possible it  would certainly be a good idea to have 3 'in stock'

Alan Petrie

I agree with you. If it is only for our benefit then no.  But you brought it home to me that maybe one or even two of our girls won't make it.  How unbearable.  I don't know how you all coped last year.  

But I think we should leave the decision to the experts.  

Diane in Indiana: I'm glad you put "rulebook" because I fear this may be a mythical tome, and even if there is one I've never seen them handed out to ospreys!

Does anyone know how a male osprey is supposed to "teach" his offspring to fish? (other than catching a fish in their presence).

Yes, Alan. LG are the experts. I agree. All we can do is donate cash for THEIR agenda.

Cirrus-I was convinced the monies were to pay for the one ordered when it was ready and for the cost of tracking this time. I will look back through the comments and read what Richard write again and get back to you.

JILLIAN

I think that's it Sandy. Someone knowledgeable somewhere said that the juveniles learn by 'seeing' what other Ospreys do but they do also have an 'innate' idea of what to do..

Goodnight everyone from Tracy Island zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Sandy R Poulter

Your avatar bothered me for ages until I realsied it was two ospreys..  They are made of wood aren't they?

They are rather beautiful if they are carvings.

AT

Goodnight to Lady P and Thunderdog Hamish.  See you all tomorrow.  x

Thank you so much for the update Katie, wonderful to hear about Rothes.

And Odin gone as well. What a shock. I so hope he returns nexy year. He and EJ made the perfect couple.

Evening Gary

Has any one heard from paula (formerlypmc) or Maureen lately?  Missing them !!

As I said yesterday I will wait to hear from Richard Thaxton and the LG team. I am sure they already know what they wish to do in 2010 and I am prepared to be guided by their expertise. I am sorry you feel that Garten should have been tagged rather than Mallachie as I feel it is too early to look at 'in hindsight'. I know many would have loved to have seen all three tagged but Roy Dennis made a decision, which I respect, to tag Rothes and Mallachie.

As Alan says, I will donate again but I just want to know that in the long term the birds will benefit eventually, and it is not just for the sake of bloggers on GE.  

Brenda

I agree with you and now I am switching off.  Sore fingers and too much excitement for one day>>  Night night  see you tomorrow. xx

Cirrus

Nighty night xx

Hi Tish. It is a sculpture which has recently been erected on a roundabout on the Oakham bypass! I pass there on the way to Rutland Water and one day it was just there!

Luckily, I had my camera with me so stopped to take said photo. Up close I thought it was slightly "rough" but it is very striking from a distance.

When I got home I looked it up and found out why it looked "rough" it is a sculpture done with a chainsaw!!

Just thought it would make the perfect avatar (hate that word).

Well if it's done with a chainsaw it's pretty darn clever I would say.  It is outstanding.  My eyes aren't that great any more and I thought it was somebody with a mohawk hairstlye at first LOL  sorry!!

And I also hate that word avatar. sounds like abatoir or something.

Night night and thanks for letting me know X

Tish, if you are still around. Paula is on FB but I think is still trying to get used to returning to work.

Maureen, where are you? Hope you are OK. You are missed.

Nite nite Tish . Me nighty niting also

Why DO we say 'avatar' anyway?  Nite nite Sandy

 We use it cos it means somebody who embodies an idea or concept. (apparently) So our pictures are what we symbolically embody

Good night all

Brenda H

I totally agree. The tagging  must produce  information that will  enhance their survival.  It was said that the place where Rothes is staying in France  is popular with  many migrating Osprey.  Is it  protected  area?  If not can money be collected  provide more protected areas where the tagging  shows they stay  during their migration?  Or money for the Sturgeon fish farm to encourage them to be   supportive of the Osprey who  pinch their  fish. LOL  Or could money be used to  erect more nesting poles since the  Osprey population is growing. I just think there is a lot of work yet to be done for these birds not just tagging.

I just watched the video on real player.   When the fish arrived about 6pm  Mallachie was still on the branch eating what must have been the same fish she'd had for hours.  Garten joined her on the branch for about 10 minutes and then left.  When Garten left Mallachie was watching her and looking towards the nest.  When the camera zoomed in on the nest the fish and Garten were there so think EJ must have delivered it.  It looked quite big.

Garten had a bit of fish then left the nest with the fish.

That's interesting, Teresa.

We all seemed a bit confused there about both birds and fishes.

Learn to fish yourselves, girls, & then Mum can go on her hols!

Night everyone.  (thanks again to Annette & Diane, and Aquilareen & Wattle, & all who are not asleep)

Teresa, thanks for taking the trouble to look back on that. With Odin gone, it had to be an EJ delivery.

Katie, (late) thanks for the update!

Fellow bloggers, I don't post often... but read all your comments, thanks :-)

Alan, I sooo agree with you about the tagging and the last part you wrote, "if it is just for our benefit to follow them on GE then I am not happy to donate."

Sandy: I agree with you about the "rulebook." I think that with the new technologies, the knowledge about osprey behavior is evolving rapidly.

I guess what I was struggling to understand is this:

Mallachie, and apparently Garten, appear to repeatedly return to Loch Garten and not seek out more viable sources of food. So I was wondering whether EJ (now that Odin has left) will encourage them to follow her to better sites, so that they will know how to identify a good site during migration.

But I also realize that it is normal for young ospreys to learn to fish successfully during their first migration, and, as Cirrus has said, the instinct is innate in them. So we shouldn't make the assumption that they are lagging in development, and all of them will move on when they decide conditions are right, regardless of what we think. LOL

All the blogs sound interesting and perhaps it would be in order if an appeal went out for money for tagging etc. to help the survival of the osprey population. Sounds a reasonable idea to help the sturgeon farmer as the ospreys are pinching his fish!! Maybe they accept it and are happy to allow it, does anybody know this - perhaps the RSPB or other bodies concerned with the preservation of these magnificent birds.

Perhaps the LG team will be able to enlighten us at some stage when they are not too busy??

Regards tagging I think we should consider Roy Dennis's decision not to satellite tag anymore juveniles in his project as every single one he has tagged has perished.  Heather and Thistle in 2007, Glen, Moray, Deshar and Nethy in 2008.

I agree with Roy Dennis regarding not to satellite tag anymore juveniles...I enjoy watching birds but I was very concerned when I found out what it means for a bird to be tagged. An antenna and a backpack, even if very light, could put a bird in danger: the antenna could get trapped in a tree. I know they do their best to look after the birds safety but, as every single bird Roy has tagged has perished means tagging puts the birds in danger. I am glad Garten didn't get tagged! The money collected could be used to improve the welfare of our beloved birds.

A lot of juveniles that have been tagged have perished but a number of juveniles have carried transmitters successfuly. SSK in 2002 wowed the world with its antics before reaching Portugal. It apparently made it back to the UK and is a nesting bird still carrying its transmitter. 06 (01) from Rutland also carried a transmitter and nested successfully in 2003.

Mirja a Finnish juvenile successfully carried a transmitter to Africa and back from 2002 to 2006.

There are at least three American juveniles that have carried transmitters to South America. The transmitters have shown that they have to grief for reasons like being shot.

So it is possible for a juvenile to carry a transmitter.

Sandy R said Does anyone know how a male osprey is supposed to "teach" his offspring to fish? (other than catching a fish in their presence).

That would be about it, wouldn't it?  They have seen him (and her) come in with fish in their talons.  But how much more the young would know if they follow him to where he catches the fish, follow him around as he searches the water, then watch the actual diving procedure and voila! pulls out food!  How much is teaching and how much is built-in instinct  and how much do the experts know and how much are they still trying to learn?  Isn't all this known and unknown one reason we find our birds so fascinating?

June whether juvenile ospreys are taught to fish or not is a moot point. One thing that is certain is that young ospreys can learn by themselves because otherwise translocation (hacking) projects would not be possible. Also Mallachie seems to have missed out on the fishing lesons.

That said there was a report recently on the DPOF board of a male osprey fishing in the company of seven juveniles.

This is a really long nervous wait now girls. Dont you know winter is a comin and places South would be more welcoming? Good luck anyway.

Ardo

Oh dear, unwittingly,I seem to have started quite a debate regarding the financing of tracking after yesterday "katie's blog atomic osprey- my remarks- tinker 24/08 17.04" - "I wish Garten was tagged!!!  Is it lack of money that prevents all of them from being tagged? or some other reason. If it is monetary, I'm sure that next year we could have a whip round - or sponsorship???"

Being completely new to the world of Ospreys, or RSPB at all, never before having any involvement. I am so enjoying following EJ's family, but perhaps I am too enthusiastc too soon before knowing anything about it.

I stand by what I said about the tagging & the money raising. I had no idea what had happened previously, but I am getting the picture. There seems to be quite a few views on what you would like be done, providing it is condoned and approved by the professionals who have the job of doing it of course!!

Sorry if I have caused a bit of a "hoo ha" - please forgive my ignorance - I know nothing about it, but am willing to learn!! I am thankful that there are those amongst you with lots of experience who have been good enough to explain things to me e.g. Jillian, the Brendas, Alan,[sorry if I have missed anyone but you know who you are!].

Tinker: Not to worry - I'm also new to the world of ospreys and understand the issues more clearly thanks to the debate, which is all to the good!

5:17 a.m.  Don't all rush but there's the nest and it's empty!

Hi, Annette. Big 'ol lonely empty nest. Not even a breeze stirring this morning.

It was my understanding that UK was supposed to get the tail end of Hurricane Bill today? Nest weather doesn't look too bad so far.

Hey Diane: Looks pretty peaceful there. So, the rumor is that Odin has left and that the others are still there. Did you see the link to the Tweed Valley ospreys? Apparently, the folks there are surprised their birds still haven't migrated.

Shoot. I meant to read that Tweed Valley article. Kind of an odd year for ospreys, I think.

Tiger said that the juveniles have been known to stay around until almost mid-September. Seems odd that EJ hasn't left, though.

What are you up to? I took it sort of easy today after my escapades in the garden yesterday.

I'm crazy about owls, and I watched the Barn Owl Trust owls from the beginning this year. The youngest juvenile keeps returning to the barn and even to the nest box, and it hasn't dispersed as per the norm. Kind of strange, too.

Mid September? Wow. That's another three weeks of speculation and angst for some bloggers!

I took it easy today, too. I moved brush yesterday. The last thunderstorm had dumped a limb on the roof, and limbs were down all over the yard. So I tried to clear the debris. I was tired today. Think I've got a bit of flu. We have a lot of that here right now.

Yeah, Tiger said, "... in 2004 the youngest chick left on 12th September." We could all have ulcers by then. LOL

I got to see an owl really close up last year. I was at the local garden center and someone - a volunteer with the Wildlife Rescue folks - stopped by with an owl that he had in a box. He took it to a quiet corner and let a few of us take a look. It had huge amber-colored eyes - so beautiful. Two weeks ago, the neighbors were trimming a tree where an owl hangs out and it was major surgery to work around that part of the tree without disturbing that area.

Flu in August, eh? Well, the television news folks already are using superlatives to describe the anticipated effects of the swine flu! And we haven't seen that much of it yet! Honestly, if it's not a crisis, it will be by the time they've finished with it/

Looking at the weather maps this morning Diane, it is on it's way, not a good day for Ospreys to be seting off on a trip.  Strong winds and heavy rain!!

Lucky you to see the owl so close! We have a pair of Great Horned Owls on the property. One night I went out very late, to see whether the creek was flooding. One of the owls was on a low branch and it hooted at me. They are enormous owls, I think the biggest, and the sound was quite loud. I just stood still. He looked at me and I looked at him. A very special moment.

Hey, Suzyblu. I thought that's what I heard. Hurricane Bill was kind of wicked here in the states. Hope everybody over there stays safe. Surely the ospreys will know to stay put. I'm sure that they know it's coming.

6:28 a.m. and here come Tweedledum and Tweedledee aka our Fat Friends. (Sorry!) Mallachie is plopped down and Garten is peering over the edge.

OK. Now we're in the sit and wait (them and us!) mode.

Did Mallachie just back into a branch? She sort of jumped.

Mallachie decided to do a bit of furniture rearranging. And then some fledgling-like wing flapping and hopping about. She knocked that one big stick completely out of the nest after wrestling with it. I think she had a bit too much caffeine in her morning coffee.

Mallachie just took a fly around the nest but is back now.

Sorry Suzyblu - Good morning. Didn't see your message earlier.

Now they are both bowing their heads. Praying for a fish delivery, I guess!!! They look so funny, side by side, heads bowed solemnly.

I thought for a minute, from the way they waddled over to the right side of the nest, that someone was arrive with eats, but no. Maybe the camera man showing up early?

It looks a beautifully calm, sunny day today in Ospreyland, with two young sisters enjoying each other's company until a fish magically appears.

Mallachie just left in a huff. To see off an intruder... try to find EJ...or just to burn off her caffeine buzz. That bird is wound tighter than a cheap watch this morning.

Hi Wattle!

Well, Mallachie lef and a minute or so later, Garten followed.

And I'm about to fly away too. Tired again and if, as someone mentioned, they could be here another couple of weeks, then I need to get some shut-eye. Night all!

And Garten is gone, too.

Ok, nest is once again empty. And I need to turn in. Should be an interesting day for all of you.

G'night, Annette, Wattle, Suzyblu and others. Hang on to your perch, Ghost Parrot.

Yes indeed, another empty nest and this page as slow as molasses... :-(

Night all!

Remains of Hurricane Bill have arrived!

Just to set record straight I am not against the tracking of the juvenile ospreys but I would want it to be done in the context of scientific exploration and strictly controlled and once enough information has been gathered about migration patterns of juvenile ospreys then it would be unneccessary to tag anymore. The fact that Roy Dennis and the RSPB take time to put information out in the public domain is an added bonus and the public following of the tracked birds should never be the prime objective of the exercise.

I did donate to the tracking fund this year but if more tagged juveniles are lost I doubt I would again.

Tiger  

Good to have you back

Got onto this page with difficulty this morning, a lot of 'error' messages and such, so don't know if its the same for everyone- curved round it by finding an old link to the Follow Nethy & Deshar page.

One lonely bird on the nest at present, looks windy, too.

A lot of us had problems Lindybird and so started off on FB. I HOPE it's the RSPB putting the zillion notifications of each post to rights.

Just  Garten  on nest currently.

Morning all.

Both M&G have been active, on/off nest but no fish deliveries yet.

Will the person who explained that if I deleted Deshar using the edit menu forgive me, I've forgotten who you are. But it does not delete permanently and yes, I would rather delete his route permanently. I have happier memories of him, bless him. And certainly could not ever forget him.

Out here on the western edge of the UK (N. Ireland) we had torrential rain in the night but not the high winds, so far.  Hope that part of Hurricane Bill has bypassed us!  I agree with those who think tagging should be done for scientific reasons, not our gratification.  I donated to the taggin fund anyway!  Lol

Those who have been blogging for some time will be aware of this, but newer members may be interested.

Concerning the discussion about funding for tracking and the funds needed for Abernethy Forest to be enlarged and revert to its former glory. This is being done by replanting the native species of Scots Pine. This will mean more trees and probably more osprey nests. In July this year a dear friend Elizabeth, passed away one month before her 97th birthday. She was a member of the RSPB and was dedicated to caring for animals and birds. This did become a bit of an obsession in her old age and it would be not unusual to hear of her trips into the garden very early in the morning to care for her feathered friends. Well I decided that rather than send flowers to the family for the funeral, I donated to the Abernethy appeal, and privately dedicated an area of forest, in her memory, which I advised to the family, of course. Well at the funeral it was sad, as you would expect, but when I saw the small display of wreaths and bouquets of flowers, laid out to go to waste, because it is no longer policy to send the flowers for hospitals, nursing home or hospices in the UK, I was glad of what I had decided to do. If anyone feels that this idea appeals (no pun intended) to them then here is the link. www.rspb.org.uk/.../index.asp One grandson in particular, was very attentive in caring for his granny at the nursing home in Surrey and I shall get a picture or painting of Abernethy Forest, to give to him and his family for their Christmas.

Is it Odin or  Mallachie?

I thought it was Garten

Not sure its either Cirrus

NOt mallachie as no backpack but can't see leg rings

I don't think that is Garten as there is a lot of white above beak

Definitely NOT Garten Just compared photo from Facebook and still from camera. Too much white!

Sure it's Garten, shes calling for something to fill her stomach, as usual.

Sun yesterday, rain again today.  Def getting colder.

Haven't read all the posts yet 'cos I must do some work today.  But everything all our birds do (well most of them) is down to instinct.  Sparrows etc. know how to feed from feeders, and what about that duck who nests high in a tree and the babies know to jump out and they'll be ok.  They have not been "taught" it's in all animals and we poor humans don't know why. We have to be taught most things thats why I think birds and animals are wonderful and know so much more that we will ever know and that annoys people who try to understand them.

And things we don't know we think we should.   And that is only my opinion because maybe I think "man" makes sucj a sodding mess of nature that animals and birds don't.  Please don't anybody shout at me I really don't know much but thats what I believe. I am a very simple soul!  :)))

It is SO frustrating that the pages, particularly the Update page takes so long to load. I find it difficult to remember in which order various images should go online. Thankfully today it looks like there will be fewer. I'll try for 'appealing ' shots if I can.

Looks like Garten has temporarily given up and left the nest.

Close up of legs but can't make out a ring on either

Absolutely agree with you, Tish.  Man just makes a mess of what nature has given us, we are so ignorant and greedy. Animals and birds have more instincts (have we just buried ours in our heads somewhere?).

That's why I admire nature so much, it just gets on with life.

I totally agrre with you tish.

Hurricane watch on Tracy Island:

Temp 15.5

Light Rain

Wind: S 16mph 26kph

Hum: 93%

Press: 1008mB

Vis: Moderate

The Tracking Debate goes on!!

I was horrified when someone said that the backpacks could be responsible for the deaths of some birds, & could get caught in trees etc. If there is any chance of that happening to our wee Mallachie or Rothes, I say take them off now!!!  

It's Mallachie I can see her aerial

Mallachie in tree and a song springs to mind

"Wishing and Hoping"

"Thinking and Praying"

"Planning and Dreaming"

"OF FISH"

FAB

Thank you so much Alan Petrie I really appreciate that.

AT

Weather here is chucking it down again. My garden is overgrown I think I'll leave it that way LOL

Treats for Thunderdog. X

Lindybird

Knew you were a sensible girl:))  x

There's definitely an aerial showing here. But IS it Mallachie?  Confirmation (or not) someone please.

Tish, agree wholeheartedly with you. If man hadn't thought he knew better or even didn't give a damn----------- but at least now so many people are more aware and are trying to rectify the situation but have to battle with ignorance and complacency. I may become too political so will 'shut up.

Where were you IR when I needed my ceramic birdbath rescuing from my apple tree earlier?

It could be Gollum's song!

Tinker: yes yes. But are we sure it WAS the aerials causing the accidents here? By golly goodness. Tiger ?? Any wisdom please?

I'm on your side Tish. Man has ruined the planet, not nature.

regarding the tracker devices, when I was up at LG a few weeks ago, Malcolm very kindly explained regarding the ordering of the devices, this has to be addressed early in the year. It would be a complete waste if say 3 devices were ordered then (they have to be ordered early apparently) and then perhaps there were no surviving chicks they would be landed with three expensive devices which would then go to waste. Thats why and I can understand this, the decision has to be made very carefully. I genuinely think raising the money would be quite easy as there are so many people, like ourselves, who care so much and are more than willing to donate.

This must be very hard for you guys up there to decide about - what I wondered was is it possible say if you had maybe 2 ordered and there were, like this year, 3 surviving chicks, could you maybe buy one from another centre.  Or indeed if you had 3 ordered and only 2 surviving chicks would it be possible to sell one to another centre?  

Sorry, hope you can all understand my garble!  

I have nothing but praise and admiration for you guys and gals at LG. You are doing a truly wonderful job - I am proud to say my interest in the LG ospreys has become my main hobby this year!

Lindybird : don't you have these sites Bookmarked ?

www.rspb.org.uk/.../the-stationary-sisters.aspx

www.rspb.org.uk/.../lochgartenvideo.asp

www.rspb.co.uk can take a while to load as it's so popular as well you know

DIANE IN INDIANA-I was alos besotted with the Barm owl trust 3, after the ones I have been following nearer my part of England failed after mum/dad abondoned 2 1 and 3 day old chicks and 2 eggs in Cornwall.I found the barn owl trust who had mended one of the owls at the Heligan gardens leg previously. I started watching when they were abour 3 weeks old and was always concerned for the third chick who I eventually called "Fluffy" as he/she remained fluffy for so long and was soooo far behind in his/her developement. It was lovely to see his/her sister (number 2 chick) hang around for quite a while until he/she was flying well. I was sad and happy when fluffy went but as you said now and again he/she keeps returning and I wonder whether fluffy will stay in the imediate area and use the barn through the winter, we will wait and see.

GENERAL-Each time I write a blog I have to sign in again, can anyone tell me if they have to do this as well, is it the norm???

JILLIAN

I totally agree with you tish.....we can learn so much from nature.

Man is very arrogant if he thinks he will ever know half of what nature knows.

Cirrus : As you well know IR are in constant demand and we have to prioritise. Now let me see where do bird baths in trees come on the list?. You are right it could be Gollum's song. I wondered when Lord of The Rings would come into the discussions.

Mallachie in tree.

As hurricanes go this is a bit of a flop dont you think?

"Wishin & Hoping"  -  very good Alan, could be our greedy girls' song (another fan of Dusty Springfield here, giving my age away!)

V. windy here, and rained a lot in the night, so full waterbutts now. Have to do the ironing instead of the garden, hate ironing unless something worth watching on TV - some hopes.

Yes, I'm puzzled now Sue. Do they not store well or something? (assuming funds) Why not a whole stock cupboard to be used by lots of centres. (well, several anyway) Or is this too simple? Thought so. Ah well.

Tinker, read Tiger's message at 23.29 last night. There are many reasons why juveniles perish and you have to remember how few birds are tagged each year.

RICHARD-WOULD BE GRATEFUL IF YOU COULD READ AND REPLY TO THIS TODAY AND READ Sue Stephen's blog just above mine. Lots of discussion recently about tagging all the chicks in a group and that it is difficult that Garten wil not be able to be tracked as well. We all understand what happened and why she has not been tagged this year and support all your team with any decisions made this season.

Would it be possible to start collecting in September when all the chicks/family have departed to get enough money in early to take some of the pressure off you.? Also would it be possible to buy 3 this time in case we are blessed with three chicks next year? If there is 1/2 left next year as we obviously don't know what is going to happen, could any spare not be kept for 2011?

PLEASE CAN YOU REPLY OR IF NOT AS YOU ARE VERY BUSY PERHAPS SOMEONE WRITE SOMETHING IN YOUR COMMENT TONIGHT FOR EVERYONE TO SEE. THANK YOU SO MUCH .JILLIAN (An osprey/owl and eagel addict now).

Taff:  thanks for help & advice-  a lot of people had problems this morning, so the gremlins are at work again today, maybe they like the wind that's got up, or something.

I have to go and do the shopping task now with Lady P.

Catch up later

Mallachie still in tree.

FAB

No Jillian it is  NOT the norm.

IR - don't hold your breath, wind increasing to storm force here, or seems like it. You'll soon have lots of rescues for the team to handle  FAB

I haven't commented a lot but I think that tagging is only one part of the story we also have to think about the birds habitat and at LG I think they are also taking this into cosideration. The cameras give us the opportunity to follow the lives of the magnificent birds but if the area wasn't kept condusive to these birds we wouldn't be able to follow their story therfore we should leave it to the experts to decide what to do with any donations that are made to this wonderful site

"  Posted on Tuesday, 25 August 2009 at 23:29   By Tiger : Many many thanks. Just had a re read Tiger.

A lot of juveniles that have been tagged have perished but a number of juveniles have carried transmitters successfuly. SSK in 2002 wowed the world with its antics before reaching Portugal. It apparently made it back to the UK and is a nesting bird still carrying its transmitter. 06 (01) from Rutland also carried a transmitter and nested successfully in 2003.

Mirja a Finnish juvenile successfully carried a transmitter to Africa and back from 2002 to 2006.

There are at least three American juveniles that have carried transmitters to South America. The transmitters have shown that they have to grief for reasons like being shot.

So it is possible for a juvenile to carry a transmitter. "

OH NO-I don't know if anyone has already mentioned this and Iv'e missed the blog but just been checking all our others osprey sites and the Queensland one.

The Queensland nest had been moved earlier in the year to build another road and the ospreys had an egg and a chick born in the new site on 12th August. I have been checking every few days and all looked normal. Just checked and there is some new information to say that the chick and egg have failed. The chick can be seen in their webcam picture as they are leaving the cams on, maybe hoping for mum and dad to start again, so sad.

Better get on now and continue washing my carpets, back later.

JILLIAN

Absolutely right George G and good morning. (it's still only 11.22 am)

I agree George G.  Abernethy forest is so beautiful and it must remain so.  One case where nature depends on man to keep things safe  and the way they ought to be

Cirrus

I have to say this -- when you post it is so delightful I can almost here the tone in your voice.  You get excited, angry upset.  excellent writing.

Brenda H - [missed that one] thanks, it is very reassuring to know this - so thanks Tiger, as Tish says "you are very wise!!"

Jillian - on that bit to Richard, well done!

Sue Stephen - not garbled at all, completely understood, & my sentiments exactly regarding LG staff & all that they do.

I had just taken ages to find that Cirrus !!! but never mind, it can stand re-reading!!

Mallachie on a branch  no she's flown away. cam person panning right to nest where both girls are sitting waiting to be fed I assume.  Naughty girls go and fish for yourselves.

When you look ar the two sisters all their feathers puffed up and trying to keep warm and there's Rothes sun bathing in the sosuth of France.  

Morning all, and a bit late signing on today.  The debate goes on, I too am new to osprey watching this year so maybe we had better leave it to the experts to judge what may be the better course open to them re tagging or not.

At the present moment after both sisters were on the nest, Garten flew back to the tree and left Mallachie on the nest.

Have they eaten yet today or is EJ holding off hoping they will fish for themselves???